[HP] With home-grown players to the top (2)

看板Hattrick (HT足球管理遊戲)作者bolam (95 10 23步排入伍)時間9年前 (2015/05/23 23:55)推噓3(3推 0噓 10→)

留言13則, 3人參與討論串1/2 (看更多)

http://www92.hattrick.org/Community/Press/?ArticleID=18924 作者 HPE-Frank_ Four years ago, I wrote “With home-grown players to the top” (13392). In that article, I predicted that within 15 seasons, I would rise to the top leagues, without buying any players. Almost 15 seasons have passed since I started this project. Time to evaluate! 四賽季前，作者寫了With home-grown players to the top一文 (13392)，這位作者預測，他可以在15賽季內，不買任何外援，只靠母會球員，爬到頂級聯賽，寫文到現在已經超過15賽季，檢驗吧。 In 2010, after having played Hattrick for five years, I was forced to start all over again. With my new club I decided to make my own home-grown team plan. At first, the whole idea of playing without any players from outside was just for fun, but after a while, I calculated that with my plan, I should be able to get very decent ratings. I wrote it all down in the HTP-article mentioned before, published in 2011 (13392). 2010，玩HT的5年後，作者被迫重新開始玩遊戲。這位作者開始決定只用母會球員，不買任何外援。這計畫，一開始只是好玩，但是不久後，透過計算，作者認為他的球隊可以得到很好的評級。這些計算都記錄在(13392)這篇2011年的社論。 I calculated that 1) I should be able to get 448 hatstats and that 2) I would compete in the highest leagues. In the discussion following publication in 2011 (15076967.1), many users doubted about the possibilities of my plan, so we agreed to talk again after 15 seasons. Ever since, I’ve followed the plan quite close. 作者計算得到的結論 : 1. 可到448評級 2. 可升到頂級聯賽並有競爭力 (該作者是哪國啊 ?) 在2011年(15076967.1)一文中，很多人對計畫持懷疑態度，當時決定15賽季後重新檢驗。從那時起，作者幾乎完美的執行他的計畫。 Skills 技能 In 2011, I calculated the player skills I should get after 15 seasons of training. I am happy to see that the training calculator did its job well at the time, because I’ve managed to reach most desired skill levels after 15 seasons. In short (without going into too much detail), my players (sorted by age) are like this now: 在2011年，作者計算透過訓練，15賽季後的球員技能地圖。當時的計算結果是好的，15賽季過去，該作者幾乎達到了他想得到的技能。以下簡短介紹。 32 year old: 32歲老B 1 goalkeeper: level 11 goalkeeping with lvl 10 defense. 守門員一枚，守門11級 + 防守10級 27-31 year old: 27-31老B 1 wingback: lvl 12 defense with 11 winger and 10 passing. 2 central defenders: 12 defense, 11 playmaking and 9 passing; one of them has 9 winger as well. 3 inner midfielders: 14 playmaking (all dropped from 15), 10 defense and passing; two of them have 8/9 winger as well. 2 wingers: 14 playmaking, 12 wing, 11 passing and defense, 7 scoring (both quick). 3 defensive forwards: 13 playmaking, winger, scoring and passing (350k+ tsi). The other one is 11/12 on those 4 skills. The third one is technical: 11 playmaking, passing and scoring, 9 defense, 7 winger. I thought of him as a player for the bench, but he plays most of the time as TdF. 邊後衛1人，防守12 + 傳球10 中後衛2人，防守12 + 組織11 + 傳球9，其中1人帶邊鋒9。中前衛3人，組織14(從15下來的) + 防守10 + 傳球10，其中2人帶8/9級的邊鋒。邊鋒2人，組織14 + 邊鋒12 + 傳球11 + 防守11 + 進球7 (2人均速度哥) 防守前鋒3人，1人組織13 + 邊鋒13 + 進球13 + 傳球13 (350000+ TSI) 1人組織、邊鋒、進球、傳球均11-12。 1人組織11、傳球11、進球11、防守9、邊鋒7，技術哥，板凳球員，但是長打TDF。 22-23 year old: 22-23歲球員 3 normal forwards: the first has 12 scoring and passing. The other two have 11 scoring and passing. 常規前鋒3人，第一人進球12 + 傳球12，其他兩人進球11 + 傳球11 All of them have 11 to 14 set pieces and rising. 以上的球員都有11-14的定位球，而且還在上升中。 I got 3 headers (2 defenders, 1 forward), 6 (!) quick players (3 forwards, 2 wingers and 1 inner midfielder), 1 technical forward and 1 unpredictable forward. I am especially happy about my quick wingers and forwards. They are very effective. 作者有3個頭球(後衛2、前鋒1)，6個速度哥 !! (前鋒3、邊鋒2、中前衛1)， 1個技術前鋒，1個不可預測前鋒。作者對速度前鋒和邊鋒很滿意，他們很有用。 All this amounts to 1.8m tsi and 166k wages. 這批球員總計達到1.8M TSI，166K工資。 Ratings 評級 In the 2011-article I predicted I would be able to reach 448 hatstats. In reality, however, I get higher ratings. 509 hatstats is my record, playing pin at home: (515850184), using a neutral coach. In P-stats (57.9) I had the strongest team of all Spanish divisions in the sixth round of season 46: (http://goo.gl/YfOfJi) 作者在2011年預測可到448評級，事實上作者最高紀錄到達509，在(515850184)這場主場開普通，使用平衡教練的比賽。在P-stats (57.9)，作者在46賽季的西班牙聯賽第六比賽日事最佳隊伍。 (http://goo.gl/YfOfJi) Below, I give you an idea about the strength and limitations of my current home born and grown team, sorted by zone: 以下簡單介紹作者只有母會球員，球隊近期的優缺點、限制以區域分類。 Defense 後防線 Playing 442 without individual orders, I only get ET (level 16) in counter attack ability, and - more important - around level 15/16 in all three defense zones: (513329581), and this last example even includes a pullback. This means that my defense is the weakest link of my team. I will not be able to put a decent counter attack formation in the highest league levels: no way I reach divine side defenses, not even playing with 5 defenders or with a defensive minded coach… 防守是罩門 !! 打442，不設定特別的換人條件，防守反擊戰術評級為16，三線防守只有15-16。 (513329581)這場最近的比賽，甚至包含了回撤事件。這代表防守是球隊最弱的部分，無法在西班牙最高聯賽放好的防守反擊陣容，到不了邊防20級，甚至打5後衛、使用防守教練也到不了邊防20。 In non-counter attack games, my defense is normally good enough: I played 253 against a first division team, and managed to stop his attacks by boosting just one side of my defense. This is because (as said), most top teams use 2 TdF’s, which is great for their side attacks, but leaves them with virtually none center attack. I kicked this team out of the cup reaching level 17 on right defense, 11 on center defense and leaving the left side defense almost open (6): (498139762). Also here, the pullback helped me. 不打防反的比賽，通常防守是足夠的。作者打253應付一只頂級聯賽隊伍，使用一個足夠強的邊防評級去防守。這樣的策略，通常是因為大部分頂擊球隊使用兩個TDF，讓邊攻到達很好的評級，但是中攻因此犧牲。作者在杯賽淘汰了這隊，使用期中一邊的邊防17、中防11、另一邊邊防6(幾乎放空城)， (498139762)這是比賽，同時撤回事件也幫了大忙。 Midfield 中場 Midfield is a strong point of my team. In ideal circumstances (mots, and all players repositioned towards middle), I can even reach a divine (20) midfield. In an important mid-league home match playing pin with high TS, I can easily reach to an ET (16) midfield. My midfield is competitive to most first division teams. 中場是強項 !! 在完美的環境(生死 + 所有球員靠中場調整)，中場評級幾乎可到20。在重要的聯賽中段戰比賽，有團隊並開普通，可以輕鬆到16中場評級，應付大部分西班牙頂級聯賽球隊，中場是作者的強項。 Attack 攻擊 If needed, I can get very good side attacks (level 24, divine ++++, on both sides): (515850165), and a mythical (very high) central attack. I don’t use the center attack option often, but having the possibility is enough: my opponents never know whether they should expect it, so they are forced to play with 3 defenders when they expect to lose midfield. Also, my three normal forwards are great subs. When one of my 11 multiskills can’t play, I put one of the normal forwards in the field. It helps that the remaining 10 multiskills can play on almost all positions. 如果需要，作者可以堆到評級24的兩條邊攻，以及一個mythical非常高中攻 (515850165) 中攻通常不是作者的主要武器，但是保持中攻的威脅性，讓對手不得不重視，對手不得不被迫在擺3後衛，如果他們預測比賽會輸(防中攻)。同時作者的三個普通前鋒也是很好的替補球員，如果作者的11個先發(多技能)有人受傷，作者就把常規前鋒放上場，也是得益於其餘10個多技能球員幾乎可以踢場上所有位置。 Average ratings 平均評級 Another way to evaluate my home-grown team's strength is analysing season averages. This gives you a more balanced idea of the possibilities. Last season, I averaged 405 hatstats and 44.0 p-stats in my league. This season, after nine league rounds, I rank 14th in Spain nationwide, with 448 hatstats and 49,8 P-stats. That’s higher than 3 of the 8 teams from the Spanish first division: (http://goo.gl/R9x8Gx). Btw, 448 hatstats is exactly what I predicted back in 2011. :) 分析賽季平均是另外一種衡量作者母會策略強度的方法，這也提供了更平衡的概念。上賽季作者聯賽平均評級405，以及44.0 p-stats。這賽季經過9場聯賽比賽，作者排全西班牙14，評均評級448、以及49,8 P-stats。 (http://goo.gl/R9x8Gx)。這比期中三隊西班牙頂級聯賽的球隊高，同時448幾乎就是作者2011年預測的結果。 In short: I get very decent ratings, but my team still isn’t strong enough to compete in a first division league. I can win against the occasional first division team (like this challenge (5845976), this secondary cup quarter final (498139762), or this tournament game (5845868)), but I don’t have a first division team myself. This is mainly because I lack the defensive strength needed for a decent counter attack-game. Without the occasional counter attack, it's very hard to build TS in the highest divisions. I hope I can partly make up for this next season with a defensive minded coach. 簡短來說，作者有非常好的評級，可以拿下任何一隊，但是仍然不夠在西班牙頂級聯賽競爭。主要還是防守問題，防守不夠威。沒有足夠的防反能力，要在高級別的聯賽建立TS不容易。作者希望能在這賽季提升防守。 Economy 經濟 In the 2011 training plan, I calculated 327k euros of weekly salaries. I think it’s mostly because of HT measures (tweaking salaries) that in reality, I never payed more than 185k a week. This only gets less, as my players are done training main skills and get older. I got 9+ million euros on my bank account, and my current two week balance extremely positive. Economy is just not really an issue for home grown teams. 在2011的預測，作者計算平均工資是327K歐元每週。但是實際上，作者從未付超過185K一週，原因主要是計算模組(tweaking salaries)。而且主力主技能訓練完成、老化，這數字會逐漸變低。作者有900M+歐元的存款，而且每兩週的損益平衡能正很多。經濟絕對不是母會技化球隊應該關心的主題。 Reached the top? 到達頂尖 At the time, I claimed optimistically: “no doubt that in order to reach the highest leagues, you’ll have to grow your own players!” Almost 15 seasons have passed, and where am I now? Well, I play in IV at the moment, but I have the ratings to promote to III: I have the best team of my division in Spain. That I play lower than expected is mainly because of bad luck. According to htev.org, I got three seasons of extreme bad luck in a row (2x wretched and 1x poor luck, see (http://goo.gl/EyuNq0), (http://goo.gl/zZfNNs) and (http://goo.gl/pahWZ2)). Also, I make bad tactical decisions too often. I am not at the very top, but I think I am getting close. As I will point out in the next part of this article, I guess I can squeeze this team out for 5 or 6 more seasons. Than I’ll have to renovate and stop being competitive for a while. So I got 5 or 6 seasons more to show what my team got. In those seasons to come, training will not be that important anymore; maintaining skills, form and stamina will be my main preoccupation. My goal now is to play in III and than, hopefully, II. That will be hard: I get high ratings, but so do other teams. I am not the only one taking advantage of the loyalty bonus and faster training! What now, how to replace my old players? The question I get most is how I plan to renew my squad once my “golden generation” (the 10/11 core players) gets too old. Once this cycle runs to an end, I will start a second cycle of 5 real life years. I will start all over again, with full power training and only 5% of stamina training. However, I will try to become competitive again as fast as possible. This is how I've planned it (roughly): Although the core of my players is from one generation (currently between 27 and 31 years old), I also have 3 younger forwards (around 23 years old) and an older keeper (now 32). I am currently training a 16 year old goalie in my youth academy, so he will be able to replace my current goalkeeper in around 3 seasons. Even when the 10 core players are very old and losing skills/stamina, I still have a young keeper and 3 relatively young forwards. Of course, I will notice a big drop in ratings, but not as big as one might think. The 10 ancient core players can still play on non-trainable positions for several seasons. Of course they will be very old (36+) with low stamina, but I can rotate the old core players on non-trainable positions using 3 subs, so I won't give away entire zones during the matches. Personally, I think that at all times in the new cycle I will be able to compete in division VI or similar. Most top teams experience a break of several seasons after having played in the top divisions, so this is not something that worries me. The alternative would be playing for a longer time (eternally?) on a lower level (like IV or V), but that's simply not my ambition. I prefer to drop back to VI and try to reach the top levels again in 2020 or 2021, when my second cycle reaches its full potential. Conclusion 節論 To conclude I would say that I am happy to see that my team is as strong (or even stronger) than I predicted in 2011. 448 hatstats proved to be a realistic, and even quite low, goal. I almost can't believe I crashed the 500 hatstats barrier! The other ambition (playing in the first division) seems harder to realise. I still have 5 or 6 seasons to get there, but it will be hard. Many other teams use the home-grown and loyalty bonus at least for some zones, and average ratings are increasing at all levels in the competition. To finalize, I would like to thank all members of the Dutch federation "Eigen jeugd in het eerste" and all participants in one of the most active threads in the Spanish national forum: "Canteranos". It's great being part of this active home-grown community! -- ※ 發信站: 批踢踢實業坊(ptt.cc), 來自: 111.248.68.180 ※ 文章網址: https://www.ptt.cc/bbs/Hattrick/M.1432396527.A.9B8.html